48 replies to this topic

[AVO]

Ashot jan, we are very much divided, geographically, religiously, politically and ideologicaly. We have no common denominator, we divide ourselves into hyastantsi vs beyrutsi, ejmiatsin vs kilikia vs amerika, dashnak vs hnchak, democrat vs communist. Yes we come together once a year, fly our flags high and scream "Shame on Turkey" then go back to our different lives. It's changing for good though and very young independent Republic of Armenia has a lot to do with it. Emphasis on young, it needs time to adjust to its new found freedom and cleanse itself from the soviet ways.

Edited by AVO, 07 February 2008 - 09:57 PM.

[Ashot]

Avo jan, I basically said the same thing with very simple words - We are separated but we are United!

[garmag]

... It's changing for good though and very young independent Republic of Armenia has a lot to do with it. Emphasis on young, it needs time to adjust to its new found freedom and cleanse itself from the soviet ways.

Hoping for those days to materialise...............
Amen to that !

[hosank]

Armenians were targeted for being Armenian not Christian... Ottomans had 600 years to get rid of Christians but ....

this comment was rooted in a touch of trajic ethnocentrism, which i attribute to many armenians. first off, the ottomans were not planning to eliminate armenians specifically, but christians in anatolia as a whole, (but we being the largest group by far were the centre of their intention)...if you had cared to learn about other minorities who suffered the same trajedies alongside the armenians, you would see that 500 000 pontic greeks, 400 000 assyrans and almost a million greeks on the agean (though they were killed or displaced later) died in the genocide. all of which were christian, while muslim minorities were not murdered..

my point is to make you understand that christianity and the armenian identity are intermingled. there is not one without the other. and the only 'muslim country' where the armenians were allowed to thrive with little pain was christian lebanon.
the armenians of syria were subjected to many porgroms for years after the genocide (my grandfather would talk about them), before they were finally accepted into syria (mostly because of syrian christians)..

We just celebrated "Sourp Vartanantz baderazm" He was in a holy war ..... We have been pretending He won a moral war!

see, this relates once more to when i told you that christianity is an undeniable part of our identity. we did not fight for christianity, but we fought because this christianity defined us as a nation, as well as the georgians and udis who fought along side us against an enemy who's pagan religion was one more factor deferenciating their culture from ours.

Did you know we also had very expensive churches built in India when Armenians were whealty merchants there?
Where are they now?

armenians may come and go about the world, but in armenia they will always stay, so monetary value of our churches IN ARMENIA are not relevant.

Should we forget all our pre 301 Christian history as being part of our culture ?

of course not, infact, in armenia, just as the church all over europe actually incorporated much of the pre christian culture of their respective nations into their religion, thus ensuring the continuity of our race.

All our legends, Haig Nahabed, Ara Keghetsig, Medzn Dikran et-al were non Christians, yet we hero worship them.

first off some of these are mythical, second, as i said, we are christians, but we do not deny our past. anyways, to be honest christianity is the only religion we might say is truly ours. before being christian we practiced persian zoroastrianism, then greek and roman paganism, none of which were armenian, but though christianity is from israel, we were the first nation in the world to be christian, and revolved our faith around our culture.

[garmag]

.....christianity and the armenian identity are intermingled. there is not one without the other. and the only 'muslim country' where the armenians were allowed to thrive with little pain was christian lebanon.....
the armenians of syria were subjected to many porgroms for years after the genocide.....

It seems to me, Ottoman/ Young Turks/ Kemalists do not diffrentiate religion to cleans Turkey from all that is not Turkish!
Can you explain why today, Muslim Kurds are subjected to the same treatment of cleansing, as were other ethnics in the past?

My memory of Syria pre 1952 was never anti Armenian! In 1915 Lebanon was (Grand Syrie et Liban).
Read "Dzarugians" Yerazayin Halebe.

In fact many Armenians found refuge back in Syria during the Lebanese civil war 1975-1990.

Unfortunatly your apparent fanaticism is not different from other fanatics that blow themselves up for dogma.....
Religious wars have been waged for centuries and still prevail as ever!

The globe is polarizing in the name of the ONE AND ONLY OR MANY take your pick.....

Vay mez.

[hosank]

that point was about the genocide, not post 1975.
arab and kurdish minorities in turkey were not persecuted during the genocide.
when i find pics of the syrian pogroms i will show them to you

[Armenak]

arab and kurdish minorities in turkey were not persecuted during the genocide.

I wouldn't be so sure (especially about the Arabs).

when i find pics of the syrian pogroms i will show them to you

I doubt this ever occurred, so photographic evidence would be nice.

[Arpa]

This week is dedicated to the 95th anniversary of the Heroic Battle of Musa Ler.

http://musaler.am/

Herisa



Hey Mos, is your sister in one of those pictures? Do you see your grandfathers house in Waqf?
http://musaler.am/20...8/13/musaler95/

PS. I am so grateful to the writer of the above for sayin Musa Ler, not Musa **** whatever.


Curch;

And this "church" in Bitias?

What is the meaning of Waqf?
What was that village called before? Movsisavan?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waqf

This article is about the religious endowment. For the Armenian village, see Vakıflı.

A waqf (Arabic: وقف‎, pronounced [ˈwæqf]; plural Arabic: أوقاف‎, awqāf; Turkish: vakıf) is an inalienable religious endowment in Islamic law, typically denoting a building or plot of land for Muslim religious or charitable purposes

In addition to the above, Waqf- plural Awqaf is the Arabic Islamic benevolent society, perhaps the world’s richest . Beside the fact that they own and operate the most profitable real estates, they are also a most charitable organization, building and operating hospitals, orphanages, old peoples homes and homes for the handicapped. I do admire them as I have seen some of their humanitarian activities.

http://en.wikipedia..../wiki/Vakıflı

Edited by Arpa, 12 September 2010 - 10:33 AM.

[MosJan]

our house / house of my grate grandparents has been leveled to ground...
My parents and my sister have been at Musaler Waqef many times and took part in the celebrations, mass & Matagh.
at this moment my parents are in Yerevan Armenia, at MusLer

PS. tools used by my Grandfather are displayed at the Musaler Memorial in Armenia..


ok time for me to go -
September 11 - 95th Anniversary of the Battle of Musa Ler (the Armenian genocide battle) takes place from 6 p.m. to midnight at Camp Arev in Cuddy Valley. Free admission with live traditional music, dancing with Armenian food and drinks available to purchase. Continues Sunday. 1701 Darling Ave, www.mousaler.org, 626-376-7420

Sunday, September 12

• 95th Anniversary of the Battle of Musa Ler (the Armenian genocide battle) takes place from 10 a.m. to 6 p.m. at Camp Arev in Cuddy Valley. Free admission with live traditional music, dancing with Armenian food and drinks available to purchase. 1701 Darling Ave, www.mousaler.org, 626-376-7420

PS:PS one of the organizers is an member of our forum . can't name him