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Armenian Pagan Deities Are Reappearing


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#1 MosJan

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Posted 31 January 2007 - 12:25 PM

Armenian Pagan Deities Are Reappearing

[September 25, 2006]


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Nineteen years ago historian Hayk Hakobyan had no idea that he was standing above an entire complex of pagan temples. In 1987 he and a group of archaeologists arrived in the village of Hoghmik in the Amasia region to study the area before the construction of the Kaps reservoir began. “The Hoghmik Complex was discovered by accident. I remember it was a very cold and rainy day. We began working and some three hours later a 13-meter-long and half-a-meter-wide platform with bones of sacrificial animals was revealed. We decided to stay,” Hakobyan recalled.

The summer residence of the Armenian gods

Near the village of Hoghmik, just four kilometers from Amasia, the archeologists discovered a complex of pagan temples. They carried out excavations between 1987 and 1993, but for very short periods of time. Because of financial problems, the group wasn't able continue its work until this year. Before that, they had all kept silent about the existence of the complex.

Today only one-twentieth of the complex has been studied; Hakobyan has trouble saying just how many generations it will take to uncover the complex completely. The work is expensive—it costs at least one million drams (about $2,500) to carry out excavations just one month per year. But this year, one month of work yielded the discovery of a temple of the goddess Anahit. Both in the times of Urartu and in pagan times, temples to all the major gods were built in complexes. According to Hayk Hakobyan, the Hoghmik site includes temples of all the principal pagan gods: Aramazd, Vahagn, Anahit, Astghik, Mihr, Barsham, and Nane.

The complex was built before Christ, during the reign of Artashes II. “I'm sure it's a whole district of pagan temples. The district stretches out one hundred meters on either side of an 80-meter-long avenue. The temples were built along both sides of the avenue. The pivot of the district consists of the halls of the three principal pagan gods, Aramazd, Anahit and Mihr,” Hakobyan said. A small earthen disc was found in one of the halls with the Greek inscription: “Four horses are being sacrificed to Mihr.” Horse skulls or entire skeletons have been discovered in nearly every room.


Children too were sacrificed in Hoghmik
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Today fifty structures have been uncovered within the pagan district that illustrate just what a pagan temple really was. Numerous pieces of earthenware crockery and other objects were found during excavations and are now in the Shirak Archeological Museum. Clay objects, iron chandeliers, and a Bronze statuette of Mihr were also discovered. And in one of the rooms, skeletons of a priest and two children were found. “One of the buried priests is 190 centimeters tall. He was buried lying on his side. There are skeletons of children next to him facing each other. These children were probably temple slaves who were sacrificed,” Hakobyan explained.

Hakobyan said that this is the first time that ancient sacrificial altars are being studied in Armenia. “There were two types of altars at that time. The victims were killed on one of them – an axe-shaped object was also found, and the offering was made on the other. There are small pools near the entrance to the building for the priests to wash their hands before the rite. The ritual also required that the priests shave their heads. An iron razor was also found in Hoghmik.”

There are round holes next to the altars for tying the animals before the sacrifice. “In the pagan era, people filled vessels with a mixture of animal blood, milk, and seeds, and threw them into the river. In this way they fed their gods to gain their favor. The pagan gods were very jealous and demanding,” the historian noted. He believes that the Hoghmik temples served six villages located along a six-kilometer stretch of the river.

The complex is made up of three layers with obvious signs of reconstruction. It functioned until the 3 rd or 4 th century AD. After the adoption of Christianity, the temples were not destroyed but gradually sealed shut. The excavations yielded an understanding of how. “The process is very interesting. After making a sacrifice, people locked the door and moved to another room. And some time later all the rooms of the complex had been sealed shut. The scene reminds you of Ancient Rome. Soon after Christianity replaced paganism during the reign of Constantine the Great, priests closed the temples dedicated to Mithra weeping and wailing in the hope that one day Mithra would return. This idea is also present in our epic David of Sassun, when everyone was grieving because Mithra-Mher had gone into a rock with the hope of returning,” Hakobyan said.

There is little scientific research on monuments from the Urartian period to the Middle Ages. This year's excavations in Hoghmik have discovered four monuments at once that are new to science. All the altars are 104 centimeters high and all the doors are 83 centimeters wide. This prompted Hakobyan to insist, “The architect had a design prepared in advance. It is evident from the excavations that the main object of worship in the Hoghmik complex was the sun. The Hoghmik temples will give us an opportunity to find out what a temple looked like, how it was organized, how temple rites were performed, what the pagan priests' class was, its composition, etc.”


From Hoghmik to the cupolas of Armenian churches
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Hakobyan believes the excavations will also reveal what happened during the Hellenistic era – whether it was a synthesis of Armenian and Hellenic cultures, or the Armenians just crudely appropriated the Hellenic culture. “Hoghmik illustrates that in the Hellenistic era we are dealing with a strictly Eastern cultural heritage. The architecture of Hoghmik is much closer to Urartian than to Hellenic architecture. When we analyze our early Christian architecture we try to understand where its foundations come from. The Hoghmik complex proves that the foundations of our architecture are from Armenia,” the historian said. He explained that one of the distinguishing features of the Hoghmik complex is that all the temple roofs are flat, but the central temple is domed. And that is where the cupolas of Armenian churches come from.

Victoria Abrahamyan


http://hetq.am/eng/c...609-amasia.html

#2 Takoush

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Posted 31 January 2007 - 12:50 PM

This is a great undertaking and a project.

Mosjan; what do you say we collect monies and send it to Mr. Haik hakobyan to aid for his excavation project? It is quite an interesting project and our culture will benefit from it.

Besides, Anahit's, Vahakn and Mher's temples along with the other gods' are excavated too. smile.gif





Edited by Anahid Takouhi, 31 January 2007 - 01:07 PM.


#3 Arpa

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 01:26 PM

Is there an Armenian version of the Discovery Channel Show- Mythbusters?
http://www.tv.com/my...39/summary.html
Why not?
Are we not the creators of the word “myth/mythologyAraspelanq”?
Above we read that, in spite of all that “myth” that Grigor Mutavorich destroyed, ruined and obliterated all vestiges of our pre-Jesuit** culture.. And all those 1700 lies.
Then, where are these pre-Lusavorich sites are cropping up from? Regardless of what our so called post-Grigor protagonists may want us to believe that all those sites were totally destroyed and razed down, not knowing that ,despite all the garbage and dirt (literally) that there still are sites, if only buried deep under dirt and ‘Gregorian ‘ “garbage” that our heritage and culture is not limited to Ejmiatsin. Go down under the altar and see the Atrushan., the Pagan hearth above which many of our so called churches were built.. Consider Aghtamar which linguistically speaking means “Haght-ev-Amur//victorious (in war) and “amur/ firm/strong”.
The references to “altar”brings to mind the Armenian word “khoran/խորան”. We will come back to that.
**Pre_Jesus/Yeshua/Hisus


#4 Zartonk

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Posted 01 February 2007 - 08:57 PM

QUOTE
There is little scientific research on monuments from the Urartian period to the Middle Ages.


Read that again. Our current cultural retrospective stands with SUCH a massive gap. Why?

QUOTE
Hoghmik illustrates that in the Hellenistic era we are dealing with a strictly Eastern cultural heritage. The architecture of Hoghmik is much closer to Urartian than to Hellenic architecture.


Yet in every history book forced on me in school, Hellenism (the universal hybrid cultures of Greco-X) is all that stands between Alexander & Rome. Just how underrated the individuality of the Armenian Plateau really is still baffles me.

Edited by Zartonk, 02 February 2007 - 01:16 PM.


#5 neko

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Posted 02 February 2007 - 09:09 AM

QUOTE(Zartonk @ Feb 2 2007, 02:57 AM) View Post

Read that again. Our current cultural retrospective stands with SUCH a massive gap. Why?



Write it again, with some additions to give it the correct emphasis. "There is little scientific research on monuments from the end of the Urartian period to the start of the Middle Ages.

Why? The influence of the Armenian Church maybe? Most of it is not a Christian period so it is not seen as important.
Contrast that with the much greater value the Greeks place on the same pariod of their history, bacause in their self-image the most important Greek accomplishments took place before the Christian era.

#6 Arpa

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Posted 05 February 2007 - 09:06 PM

QUOTE(neko @ Feb 2 2007, 03:09 PM) View Post

Write it again, with some additions to give it the correct emphasis. "There is little scientific research on monuments from the end of the Urartian period to the start of the Middle Ages.

Why? The influence of the Armenian Church maybe? Most of it is not a Christian period so it is not seen as important.
Contrast that with the much greater value the Greeks place on the same pariod of their history, bacause in their self-image the most important Greek accomplishments took place before the Christian era.

I have alluded to that phenomenon on numerous occasions.
Many cultures that capitalize on their previous heritage come to mind, in particular Greece and Egypt, whose biggest and most profitable industry is tourism . Neither of them feature their present religious or architectural culture, yet people from all over the world, of walks of life and religious or cultural heritage flock to those places to see the Parthenon etc. and the Pyramids plus. We never see ads or documentaries about the churches in Greece or even that Islamic marvel, the Mosque and seminary of Al Azhar.
http://lexicorient.c...ypt/cairo03.htm
Even the Turks are ahead of us in that department. Seldom one sees documentaries or touristic ads showing their Islamic heritage, even the jewel of their landmarks, Hagia Sophia is hardly Turkish. They invite the world to come and see Greek, Trojan, Christian (Ephesus etc.) civilizations. And yes, Aghtamar and Ani as well. Maybe they don’t want to flaunt their Islamic face in the world’s face.
Damascus never advertises their magnificent mosque, the Umayyad,
http://family.websho...74383mGrRcEyvXY
but they emphasize such pre-Islamic sites as Palmyra, Ugarith, Craque de Chevalier, Ebla and others..
http://www.galenfrys...lmyra_syria.htm
http://www.shunya.ne...arit/Ugarit.htm
Do the Jews show pictures of Synagogues to attract tourists or do they emphasize the Christian monuments, and Allah forbid, the Dome of the Rock Mosque?
Armenians must be one of the very few people to seem to be embarrassed by their pre-Christian culture. Is there a reason for that? Maybe? Despite the fact that we are The First Christian Nation, despite the fact that we, without interruption have been Christians longer than any other people and despite the fact that we emphasize this fact a thousand a day, it is doubtful that the world knows if we have a religion and what that is. But the world aside ,if we were confident enough in our present culture and faith, if we did not have a sizable contingency who are looking for the smallest excuse to revamp our present culture, even if takes to go back to our pre-Christian, and according to them our “gloriously militaristic victorious” days.
Some day, when we convince the world and show them that we are a Christian nation, that the prevailing religion in Armenia is Christianity, but above all, when we become convinced and confident in our present culture, then we can open up our pre-Christian heritage and legacy to the world, draw a line between then and now with no fear of a reversal.??
Maybe then we will invite the world to come and see how old our culture is.
With all due respects to the likes of Ejmiatsin, Geghard… and the yet in ruins Zvartnots…., we hardly have a Notre Dame, St Peter’s Basilica, a Westminster Abbey or even a St. Patrick’s of NY.
Geghard and the likes were hardly built for any esthetic or architectural value in mind but they were built in the most inaccessible and hostile terrains, carved into bedrock to simply be inaccessible to those who wished that we were not Christians, be they domestic or foreign.
Let's be honest. All the emphasis on out Christian heritage and advertising our historic Churches is not directed to the world in genaral but to the average diasporan. I have seen this. The average diasporan, specially those from America will be taken from one Christian ruin to the next for their entire stay, who willnot even wonder if there are museums or theaters. During one of my visits the itenerary of the day was Gghard and Garni. We spent so much time at the former ahhing and oohing at every rock and pebble that on the way back it was announced that due to time constraints Garni was being dropped. The entire bus stood up and cheered. I was the only one protesting and demanding a refund. And of course, I was booed down.

Edited by Arpa, 05 February 2007 - 09:57 PM.


#7 MosJan

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Posted 06 February 2007 - 06:46 AM

QUOTE(Anahid Takouhi @ Jan 31 2007, 10:50 AM) View Post

This is a great undertaking and a project.

Mosjan; what do you say we collect monies and send it to Mr. Haik hakobyan to aid for his excavation project? It is quite an interesting project and our culture will benefit from it.

Besides, Anahit's, Vahakn and Mher's temples along with the other gods' are excavated too. smile.gif



i'm up for it





#8 Error 404

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 02:32 AM

I will contribute too.

How about opening an account and contacting them(Armenian Archeologists)?

#9 neko

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 05:33 AM

QUOTE(Arpa @ Feb 6 2007, 03:06 AM) View Post

Maybe then we will invite the world to come and see how old our culture is.
With all due respects to the likes of Ejmiatsin, Geghard… and the yet in ruins Zvartnots…., we hardly have a Notre Dame, St Peter’s Basilica, a Westminster Abbey or even a St. Patrick’s of NY.
Geghard and the likes were hardly built for any esthetic or architectural value in mind but they were built in the most inaccessible and hostile terrains, carved into bedrock to simply be inaccessible to those who wished that we were not Christians, be they domestic or foreign.
Let's be honest. All the emphasis on out Christian heritage and advertising our historic Churches is not directed to the world in genaral but to the average diasporan. I have seen this. The average diasporan, specially those from America will be taken from one Christian ruin to the next for their entire stay, who willnot even wonder if there are museums or theaters. During one of my visits the itenerary of the day was Gghard and Garni. We spent so much time at the former ahhing and oohing at every rock and pebble that on the way back it was announced that due to time constraints Garni was being dropped. The entire bus stood up and cheered. I was the only one protesting and demanding a refund. And of course, I was booed down.


Though, apart from Garni, most pre-Christian sites are never going to attract mass-market tourism. But there should still be active steps taken for their investigation and preservation.

Ironically, there are probably more excavations going on at early Armenian sites in Turkey than in Armenia. Last year, the foundations of what appeared (to me) to be a very early church was discovered built on top of the remains of the Urartian temple-fortress of Altintepe, near Erzincan. Given the context, an actual connection with St. Gregory the Illuminator seems plausable. The site also has extensive fortified walls which postdate the Urartian period. Also on the site was discovered an audience hall with mosaics from the early Byzantine period that (according to the excavators) seems to have been converted into a church at a later date. But, given that it is Turkey, I think that the Turkish excavators are going to have big problems in presenting their results.

Edited by neko, 07 February 2007 - 05:36 AM.


#10 MosJan

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 07:33 AM

QUOTE(Error 404 @ Feb 7 2007, 12:32 AM) View Post

I will contribute too.

How about opening an account and contacting them(Armenian Archeologists)?





Error - please see http://hyeforum.com/...showtopic=10558

the only problem is Sasun ( Akanj@ Kanchi ) is not active
Azat is spending his time on fine wine and woman ( che Azat ? )

we need new GANDZAPAH


#11 ED

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 03:07 PM

count me in also,

Gandzapahi bane hesht a Mosjan, togh araj gan yes kstandznem naxnapes

#12 Error 404

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 06:12 PM

Edo jan,

qezanic lav pahestapet errr I mean gandsapah yes chem tshanachum. How about you?smile.gif

I can contact those guys I mean Archeologists and post here the details if necessary.

Let's help this guys. Who knows maybe they will find something that can prove finally the whole world that we are direct descendants of urartians.

#13 Zartonk

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 07:17 PM

I think this it will be the most noble deed this forum can do. Those scientists are sitting on a treasure trove of archeology, yet don't have the means to unearth it. I myself will do all I can.

#14 Arpa

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 07:33 PM

QUOTE(Zartonk @ Feb 8 2007, 01:17 AM) View Post

I think this it will be the most noble deed this forum can do. Those scientists are sitting on a treasure trove of archeology, yet don't have the means to unearth it. I myself will do all I can.

Look here;
http://72.14.209.104...m...;cd=1&gl=us
We just read that Prof. Adam Smith, one of the directors has just donated $5,000 to the project.
Many more references on the net. Search using "Project Discovery Armenia" as your keyword(s).

Edited by Arpa, 07 February 2007 - 07:57 PM.


#15 Zartonk

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 08:31 PM

Yes. Thank you Arpa.

#16 Error 404

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 12:28 AM

Looks like we are too late? Any suggestions?

#17 Error 404

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 12:35 AM

Arpa, I googled "Project Discovery Armenia" and this is what I have found lol. It is interesting.

ARMENIA
THE JEWISH COMMUNITY


Three distinct, unrelated populations of Jews have lived in Armenia -- in ancient, medieval, and modern times. The earliest Jews arrived in Armenia by the 1st century BCE or 1st century CE. The precise fate of the ancient Armenian Jews is not known. Many centuries later, other Jews arrived in other parts of Armenia, apparently coming from Persia. By the middle of the 13th century CE, a thriving Jewish community was established in the city of Eghegis. However, there was no continuity between the Armenian Jews of the Middle Ages and the Jews that settled in Armenia in the 19th and 20th centuries. Again, there is a mystery about the fate of the medieval Armenian Jews.
The contemporary Jewish populations of Armenia are descended primarily from Ashkenazic Jews from Europe, with a smaller number of Mizrakhim. In the early 19th century, Jews from Poland and Persia started to settle in Armenia's capital, Yerevan. In the 1920s, many Jews from European sections of the Soviet Union resettled in Armenia. More Russian Jews arrived during and after World War II, swelling the Jewish population of Armenia to about 5000 people. The next wave of Jews came to Armenia between 1965 and 1972. The Jewish population reached about 10,000 at its peak in the second half of the 20th century. Today, however, there are considerably less Jews living in Armenia. There may be as few as 1000 Jews in Armenia today, of which perhaps about 500 inhabit the city of Yerevan. The rate of intermarriage between Jews and Armenians is very high. The majority of 20th-century Armenian Jews immigrated to Israel in the early 1990s when the Soviet Union collapsed.

The Yerevan synagogue is operated under the direction of a Chabad Lubavitch rabbi. Rimma Varzhapetyan (Feller) was the President of the Jewish Community of Armenia as of the start of 2002. Armenian Jews widely celebrate Rosh Ha-Shanah, Purim, and Hanukkah and attend Shabbat services. Many Armenian Jewish children are involved in singing and dancing activities. The community also sponsors cultural events, meals for veterans, medical services, and Holocaust commemorations.

In general, Armenia and Armenians have good relations with Jews and Israel. But some Armenians wrongly place blame on Jews for the killing of Armenians in 1916 and despise the Jewish friendship with Turks and Azerbaijanis.


Here is the link to the whole source http://www.jewishgen...em/armenia.html

#18 ED

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 12:46 AM

QUOTE(Error 404 @ Feb 7 2007, 04:12 PM) View Post

Edo jan,

qezanic lav pahestapet errr I mean gandsapah yes chem tshanachum. How about you?smile.gif

I can contact those guys I mean Archeologists and post here the details if necessary.

Let's help this guys. Who knows maybe they will find something that can prove finally the whole world that we are direct descendants of urartians.



Errror jan,

Gandzits-Ghandz
Aryutits-Aryuts
Gnadz chem pahum, u chem el sirum (xoski poxaberakan kam uxaki imastov, inchpes vor haskanan-s)
Karevore vor Gandze npatakin tsarayelne, handzins indz hamar. indznits el lav, vstah em shater kan, u klinen, ay orinak mer forumi antam Sasun@!

It's Never to late, we can contact this organization and contribute what ever or as much as we can
It's a nobel couse



#19 Arpa

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 09:28 AM

QUOTE(Error 404 @ Feb 8 2007, 06:35 AM) View Post

Arpa, I googled "Project Discovery Armenia" and this is what I have found lol. It is interesting.

ARMENIA
THE JEWISH COMMUNITY
Three distinct, unrelated populations of Jews have lived in Armenia -- in ancient, medieval, and modern

Yeah! Yeah! Funny isn’t it?
Yes, we have seen that.
YET IT DEFIES ALL LOGIC . MAYBE, IN A MILLION YEARS I WILL FINALLY UNDERSTAND WHY OF ALL THE SITES ABOUT ARCHEOLOGY IN ARMENIA AND ASRTSAKH ONE WOULD ZERO IN ON THE ABOVE. I AM NO FREUD. IF I WERE I COULD EASILY WRITE A THOUSAND PAGE BOOK AS TO WHY ARMENIANS, WHEN SEARCHING ABOUT ARMENIAN SUBJECTS WOULD STOP AT THE LETTER J, AND WHY ALL ANTENNAE PROP UP AT THAT LETTER. IF ONE DID NOT KNOW ANY BETTER, ONE WOULD THINK THIS TO BE HRYA-FORUM RATHER THAN HYE -FORUM.
ENOUGH SAID!!!
Nothing new.
Prof. Michael Stone,(search and find him) chairman of Armenian Studies at the Hebrew University practically spends more time in Armenian than he does in Jerusalem. His wife Rima is no slouch either. She is an armenologist in her own right.
Dear Error. Could you please tell us why your search ended at the letter J?
See below a partial list, a dozen of possibly hundreds of sites dealing in Armenian Archeology.
Is it possible to talk about Armenia and Armenian subjects without bringing in the J’s?
Can we limit it to the number of times they talk about us?
This subject has been discussed practically to the ground on numerous occasions and under numerous subject topics. See one of many here;
http://hyeforum.com/...jews of armenia
Post #1 
Here is everything one needs to know about the subject and more.
BTW. Gamavor, Rimma Varzhapetian is mentioned here.

http://www.haruth.com/JewsArmenia.html

http://www.massiswee...ssue44/pg12.pdf
http://www.archaeoex...com/Armenia.htm
http://www.umich.edu...gy/Armenia.html
http://www.tacentral.com/default.asp
http://www.sciencema...602/2319?ck=nck
http://www.umd.umich...ews/stone2.html
http://www.armeniaex...ips/archaeology
http://www.churcharm...expedition.html
http://archaeology.a...Archaeology.htm
http://www.hetq.am/e...h-0104-qar.html
http://www.tacentral....asp?story_no=8
http://www.yerkir.or...nakert/eng.html



#20 Johannes

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 10:44 AM

Որպէսզի լաւ հայեր լինինք, պէտք է լաւ քրիստոնեաներ լինինք:

Լաւ քրիստոնեայ լինելու համար, պէտք է սիրենք (պաշտենք) քրիստոսը ծնող հրեայ ազգը:

Եթէ կը փնտրես պատճառ մը, ահա այս է կը կարծեմ:

It is Sad






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