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"Medieval Armenia and Cilicia Timeline" by Keran R

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#1 gamavor


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Posted 15 March 2003 - 03:14 PM

Armenia-TL-art - 2/24/99

"Medieval Armenia and Cilicia Timeline" by Keran Roslin.

NOTE: See also the files: Balkans-msg, Khazars-msg, Hungary-msg, Russia-msg,
fd-Turkey-msg, Bynzantine-msg, cl-Bynzantine-msg.


This article was submitted to me by the author for inclusion in this set
of files, called Stefan¹s Florilegium.

These files are available on the Internet at:

Copyright to the contents of this file remains with the author.

While the author will likely give permission for this work to be
reprinted in SCA type publications, please check with the author first
or check for any permissions granted at the end of this file.

Thank you,
Mark S. Harris
AKA: Stefan li Rous

by Keran Roslin

WHERE - Greater Armenia was east and south of the Black Sea. Its
boundaries changed during the centuries as invaders
carved out chunks for the empires of Rome, Byzantium and
the Mongols. It was eventually absorbed into the Ottoman

Cilicia or Lesser Armenia - Cilicia was an important Armenian
kingdom from 1198 to 1375. It was along the eastern end
of the Mediterranean coast of Asia Minor. Its port cities
included Tarsus, Korykos, and Ayas. Cilicia's western
neighbor was Isauria. The Amanus mountains were on the
east. In the north, the plains meet the Taurus mountains
and these peaks separate Cilicia from Cappadocia. In
its mountains were the many large castles which controlled
the mountain passes, including the famous Cilician Gates,
through which pilgrims and Crusaders travelled to the
Holy Land and luxury goods from the east travelled to

Agathangelos (5th century) Moses of Khorene
Gregory of Narek Smbat the Constable
Faustus of Buzanda St. Nerses Shnorhali
Ananias of Shirak
Lazarus of Pharpi Vardan of Maratha
Thomas Ardsruni Mkhitar Heratsi
Amirdovlat Amasiatsi John V of Draskhanakert (also
called Yovhannes Drasxanakertci)


36 B. C. - Marc Antony attacks the Parthians and loses 80,000
troops. He captures King Artavazd of Armenia and his
family, who he sends to Cleopatra of Egypt in golden

31 B. C. - Artavazd is beheaded in Egypt without revealing the
whereabouts of the royal Armenian treasury

66 A. D. - King Trdat (Tiridates) is crowned by Nero in Rome
and given 50,000,000 sesterces, reimbursed for the
cost of his 9 month overland journey to Rome, and skilled
artisans to rebuild his capital.

257 - Grigor (Gregory) Partev (the Parthian) is born (approx. date)
He is to be St. Gregory the Illuminator, who helped
to convert Armenia to Christianity

301 - Traditional date when Armenia becomes the first official
Christian state (303 is the alternate date) as declared
by King Trdat (Tiridates) III of Greater Armenia.

305 - St. Grigor becomes head or catholicos of the new Armenian

325 - St. Grigor dies in his cave on Mt. Sepouh

352 - Nerses becomes Catholicos, head of the Armenian church

364 - Nerses goes to Constantinople to ask for help against Persian

368 - Pap becomes king of Armenia with Roman help at age 22

371 - Battle of Bagrevand against the Persians is won by a
combined Roman and Armenian army

374 - King Pap is murdered at a Roman banquet

406 - Official acceptance of the Armenian alphabet created by Saint
Mesrop-Mashtotz and his staff. The alphabet contained 36
characters until the 12th century when 2 more were added.

428-885 - the Armenian "Dark Ages", internal civil wars and wars with
Persia, Byzantium, Baghdad and Egypt

451 - Armenian troops commanded by Vardan Mamikonian fight the Battle
of Avarayr against the Persians and lose Armenian churches
commemorate this battle and honor the Armenian dead annually

590 - the Persian lose Armenian lands to the Byzantium

600s-700s - the Byzantines and Arab Abbasids use Armenia for a
battleground; Armenian nobility and commoners who could traded
their Armenian lands for lands within the Byzantine empire
and many abandoned Greater Armenia to the invaders

885 - Ashot I crowned king of Armenia by his peers and acknowledged by
Byzantium and the Caliph

965 - Byzantium reconquers Cilicia

1042 - Ablgharib becomes governor of Tarsus and Mamistra in Cilicia and
makes it a refuge for displaced Armenians

1045 - Gakik II of Ani forced to abdicate leaving no opposition to stop
the invading Selchukid (or Seljuq) Turks

1064 - Alp Arslan, the Seljuk, conquers Greater Armenia

1071 - Seljuq Turks defeat the Byzantine Empire at the Battle of Mantzikert,
north of Lake Van

1091 - Gakik II is murdered at Cybistra Castle and his body hung out
over the castle wall

1115-1124 - sometime between these dates Gagik II's death revenged, his
weapons and clothes found, and the sons of Pantaleon tortured
by Thoros

1096-1102 - The First Crusade

1097-1098 - Bagrat contacts the crusading forces at Nicaea and accompanies
them across Asia Minor. He forms an alliance with Baldwin of
Boulogne, but Bagrat was later tortured as a traitor

1114 - large earthquake destroys the Hesuants vank' monastery, devastates
the countryside and kills 40,000+ people

1118 - another earthquake
Baldwin I of Jerusalem dies

1130 - The Franks conquer parts of Cilicia during the First Crusade but
their hold is insecure because of Byzantine invasions and the
objections of the native Armenian princes who get the upper
hand in the late 1130s

1137-1138 - Byzantine conquest of Cilicia followed by seven years of
relative peace ruled by Byzantium

1143, April 8 - John Comnenus, Byzantine Emperor, died as a result of a
poisoned arrow

1147-1149 - The Second Crusade

1151 - Rubenid family controls the Cilician plain, allies and marries
Franks and fights the Turks and Byzantines
Hromkla is given to the Armenian catholicos by Beatrice

1153 - Nerses of Lampron born

1158 - Manuel and the Byzantine army invades Cilicia, Thoros is forced to
make peace in penitential garb and receives confirmation of his
position in Armenia, but Byzantine governors are left in the
main townships

1164 - Thoros, Bohemond, Raymond of Tripoli and the Greek commander at
Tarsus, Constantine Coloman, attacks Nur-ad-Din and wins. A
large force of Nur-ad-Din's troops come and Thoros advises
withdrawal and leaves. The other leaders are captured and only
released when Thoros threatens to burn his captives alive.
Thoros' brother Stephen is lured by the Greeks into the castle
of Hamus and boiled alive.

1168 - Thoros dies, Thoros' brother Mleh invades with Moslem troops and
throws out the regent and heir

1173 - Nerses the Gracious, Catholicos dies in August, and Grigor
Tgha is elected catholicos

1174 - Mleh's use of Moslem aid is very unpopular so the Armenian barons
rise and kill him

1179 - religious synod held at Hromkla to discuss: the celebration of
Christmas on December 25, instead of the Armenian custom of
combining it with the Epiphany on January 6; the method for
choosing the date of Easter; the use of fermented bread at
mass; and changes in the church service

1180 - death of Byzantine Emperor Manuel Comneus

1188 - Saladin campaigns against Antioch and destroys Baghras which
Leon later rebuilt

1189-1192 - The Third Crusade

1190 - Levon (or Leon)sends Nerses of Lampron as ambassador to meet Emperor
Frederick Barbarossa when he approaches Cilicia, but on June 10
Barbarossa drowns in the Saleph River near Silifke, ending
negotiations for Levon's royal crown

1193 or 1194 - Catholicos Grigor Tgha dies and his nephews, Hetoum and
Shahnshah, are assassinated
Gregory V is elected catholicos (patriarch) but doesn't get
along with Levon and is imprisoned and dies trying to escape

1198 - January 6 - Levon I or Leon I is crowned king of Lesser Armenia
by the new Armenian catholicos with a crown from the
Hohenstaufen emperor. In return, he is forced to recognize
the German emperor as his lord and the pope in Rome as the
head of the Armenian Church. The Armenian church however
stalls and does not change or adopt the Roman Catholic
forms of worship
(The Cilician kings named Levon are numbered differently by
various historians. It is easier to understand who is who by
the dates of their reigns than by I, II, etc.)

1202-1204 - The Fourth Crusade

1204 - Constantinople is sacked by crusaders of the Fourth Crusade

1205 - Catholicos John of Sis accuses Isabelle of Austria, Levon's
queen and mother of his daughter Rita, of adultery and she
is imprisoned at Vahka where she died

1210 - King Levon of Cilicia marries Sybilla of Lusignan, the
daughter of King Aimery of Cyprus and Queen Isabeau
Plantagenet, and later mother of Levon's daughter and
heir Zabel (aka Zapel or Isabelle)

1211 - Levon gives his wife's sister, Helvis, to Raymond-Roupen
of Antioch

1212 - The Children's Crusade

1217-1229 - The Fifth Crusade

1219 - King Levon I dies after reigning 32 years
Zabel becomes queen, Adam of Baghras is regent

1222 - Philip, either son of Raymond the One-eyed, Count of Tripoli;
or fourth son of Bohemond IV of Antioch, marries Zabel

1225 - Zabel's husband, Philip, is arrested, imprisoned in the
fortress of Sis and killed

1226 - King Levon I's daughter Zabel is forced to marry Hetoum I (or
Hetum I) which joined the Rubenid and Het'umian families.
Zabel runs away from her forced marriage to Hetoum, but
eventually reconciles to it

1233 - Kai-Khusrau I, Selchukid (Seljuk) sultan of Roum, invades
Armenia and requires tribute, but he proves to be a
generally peaceful neighbor and trading partner.

1236 - Birth of Prince Levon son of King Hetum I of Cilicia

1243 - The Mongols arrive and shatter the Turkish empire of the
Selchukids (Seljuks) in a battle near Siwas, where
Georgians and Armenians fight in the Mongol army
and 2,000 Frankish mercenaries in that of Roum.

1247 - King Hetum I of Cilicia sends his brother Smbat the Constable
to negotiate a treaty with the Mongols

1253 or 1254 - King Hetoum I (or Hetum I) goes to visit the Great Khan
for three years and comes back through Greater Armenia, the
homeland no Cilician ruler had previously been able to visit.
He has guarantees that the Mongols will protect the Christian
Churches in their lands. Armenian troops fight in the Mongol
armies, and Hetoum occupies Marash.

1254 - Bohemond VI of Tripoli and Antioch marries Hetoum's daughter,

1256 - Prince Levon is knighted at Mamistra

1258 - Mongol and Armenian troops defeat Baghdad and extend
Cilician territory to Hromkla, a fortified site east of
Cilicia on the Euphrates River

1260, March - The Armenians and Mongols take Aleppo and Damascus
September - The Mongol forces are destroyed by a Mamluk army
under their new leader, Baybars

1261 - Prince Kostandin follows his father as lord of the fortress
of Sarvandik'ar which dominates the main roads to Cilicia
from the east and at Sis he marries King Hetoum's daughter

1262 - Prince Levon of Cilicia marries Keran, daughter of Het'um of
Lambron (Keran and two of their children died of a plague
after 1272 and before Hetoum's death in 1270)

1265 - Baybars, Mamluk leader, take Syria, Caesarea, Haifa, Arsuf,
Tibnin, and Safad and then turn on Armenia

1266 - King Hetoum goes to the Mongols for help and while he is
gone Princes Levon and Thoros are imprisoned in Cairo and
the Mamluks sack Sis, Mamistra, Adana, Ayas, and Tarsus.

1268, May 12 - The Mamluks take Antioch and massacre the inhabitants.
Hetoum gets his son released from Egypt, abdicates in Levon's
favor, and enters a monastery.

1269 or 1270 - Reign of Levon II or III (1269-88) began

1270 - death of King Hetum I; father of Fimi (Countess of Sidon) and
Levon (crown prince); brother of Bishop Hohannes (John)

1271 - Marco Polo sets out for Cathay from the Armenian port of Ayas

1272 - Thoros Roslin illuminates a gospel book for Queen Keran

1275 - another Egyptian (Mamluk) invasion of Cilicia

1276 - General Sempad, Levon's uncle, traps Mamluk troops in a
mountain pass and wins a major battle. Sempad and 300
knights die in the battle.

1285 - Levon III buys a 10 year truce with Egypt with an annual
tribute of one million silver dirhams to the Egyptians
and a promise to build no more castles
Levon III dies at age 53 (in 1285 or 1289) and on
February 6 Hetoum II (or Hetum II) becomes king
1292 - The Mamluks break the truce and take Hromkla (or Romgla) so
the catholicosate moves to Sis. Many church treasures
are lost.

1293 - Hetum II abdicates in favor of his brother Thoros (who was
strangled by their brother Smbat or Sempad). Hetum
retires to a Franciscan monastery

1294 - Hetum II resumes the throne

1296 - Hetum II's brother Smbat takes the throne, partly blinds
Het'um II, and kills Hetum's son Prince T'oros
Their brother Kostandin takes the throne from Smbat

1298 - Hetum II again resumes the throne with Kostandin's help
after regaining his eyesight
Smbat and Kostandin are sent to Hetum's brother-in-law
in Constantinople

1299 - Allied Mongols and Armenians fight the Mamluks at Homs
and win, regaining all their Cilician property

1303 - Mamluks win the battle at Merj-us-Safer against Mongol
and Armenian troops
Hetum chooses his nephew Levon, age 16, as heir

1304 - The Grand Khan, Gazan, declares Islam the official
religion in his lands and later his son ordera all
Christians throughout his lands to wear a black linen
strip over the shoulder.

1307 or 1308 - Hetum II and his nephew, now King Leon IV or V,
visit the Mongol emir Bilarghu at Anavarza and are
murdered with all their followers.

1308 - Oshin, Hetum's brother, chases the Mongol troops out

1320 - Oshin is poisoned
Young Levon is forced to marry his regent's (Oshin of
Corycus) daughter, Alice

1329 - King Levon IV or V, aged nineteen, takes charge of the
kingdom and has his unfaithful wife and her father
both killed.

1333 - King Levon marries Constance Eleanor of Aragon,
daughter of Frederick II of Sicily and widow of
Henry II of Cyprus, an unpopular match.

1337 - Cilician port city of Ayas is taken by the Mamluks

1341 - King Leon V, staying in the citadel of Sis, waits and
appeals for Western help, until the barons murder him.

1342 - The barons offer the crown to John of Lusignan who
offers the Cilician crown to his brother Guy. Guy
reluctantly agrees and comes to Cilicia. He brought
a European influence to the monarchy and encouraged
union with the Roman Church.

1344 - Guy Lusignan sends his younger brother, Bemon, to the Pope
in Avignon, France for help; but the negotiations rouse
resentment in the barons. Guy, Bemon and their
bodyguards are murdered.
Constantine III, son of Marshall Baldwin of Neghr, is
elected king. He is married to Marie, daughter of Oshin
(a former regent) and Jeanne of Anjou.

1360 - Peter I of Cyprus gets the port castles of Korykos in
Cilicia in return for helping Constantine VI against
the Karamanids

1363 - Constantine III dies of natural causes
Constantine IV becomes king of Cilicia and marries Marie
widow of Constantine III

1369 - Peter of Cyprus is murdered so Constantine VI makes a
treaty with the sultan of Cairo, which annoys barons

1372 - Queen Marie sends Pope Gregory XI a letter requesting
military help against the Moslems

1373 - Constantine is murdered, and the Pope wants Marie to
Othon of Brunswick.
Leon or Levon, son of John of Lusignan and Soldane, is
invited by the Armenians to become king.
(Soldane, daughter of King Georgi VII of Georgia, may
have been John of Lusignan's mistress and not his wife,
and her sons may or may not have been legitimate.
Levon's claims to his grandmother Isabella's estates
were rejected on those grounds by the Pope.)
Levon, delayed in Cyprus on his wife's lands, is "taxed"
by the Genoese 280 livres of gold plus 300 ducats
ransom for his crown, silver plate, and clothing. His
wife's lands are forfeited to Catherine of Aragon.
Levon is forced to sell his personal possessions to
travel and hire troops.

1374 - Levon VI, a Roman Catholic, and his wife, Margaret of
Soissons, are crowned at Sis on September 14 in both an
Armenian and Latin ceremony. They discover an empty

1375, January 15 - The Mamluks of Egypt capture part of Sis
February 24 - The rest of Sis is evacuated and burned by
Levon and his supporters
April 13 - Levon VI, his wife, and their twin baby daughters
surrender to the Mamluks
July - Levon is taken to Cairo as a captive where he is
released from jail, constantly watched and given a
daily pension of 60 dirhems

1376 - Levon's wife, Marguerite de Soissons, and daughters die
in Cairo

1382 - Levon is ransomed using money from the Kings of Castile and
Aragon, 300 squirrel pelts, a gold and silver cup, and
a gilded jar.

1386 - Levon serves as an envoy to King Richard II of England

1393, November 29 - King Levon VI (John de Lusignan) dies.
He is interred with French Royalty in the Basilica of St.
Denis. He was in France for help to regain Cilicia.
His son Guyot becomes a military man and Philippe becomes
an archdecon.

1402 - the Tartars take Asia Minor and Syria

1441 - The seat of the Armenian Catholicos is moved from Sis to

1453 - The Ottomans capture Constantinople and Armenians are
required to move into the capital
The Armenian patriarch is given civil authority over
marriage, charity work, and education of Armenians
under Ottoman control

1462 - Zacharia of Aghthamar removes the right arm of St. Grigor
Loosavorich, a relic required for church ceremony, from
Etchmiadzin to Aghthamar

1475 - Ottoman conquest of Crimea

1477 - Bishop Vrtanes of Odzop returns St. Grigor's right arm
to Etchmiadzin

1556-1602 - Reign of the Mongol Emperor Akbar, one of whose queens
was the Armenian lady Mariam Zamani Begum
Mariam's sister, Juliana, marries an exiled French prince
and serves as a physician in Akbar's seraglio.
Akbar's Chief Justice is also Armenian

1562 - Juliana and her husband Jean Phillippe Bourbon de Navarre
found the first Armenian church in India at Agra
Abgar of Tokat goes to Italy to study printing for
patriarch Michael of Sebastia

1605 - After burning and destroying what they could in the former
area of eastern Greater Armenia, the Persians require
their Armenian subjects to move to New Julfa and away
from the invading Turkish troops. Many Armenians escape
north to the Eastern European states such as Poland.

1620 - Eastern Armenia returns to Persian control

Copyright 1999, Karen Reinhart, P. O. Box 169, Windsor, NY 13865.
<keran@hancock.net>. Permission is given to use these articles in any
educational publication as long as you credit me for the authorship of the
article and send me a copy of the publication.

<the end>
Edited by Mark S. Harris Armenia-TL-art 10

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#2 hytga



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Posted 06 April 2003 - 01:45 PM

knoledge is power :blink: :unsure: <_< :rolleyes: :) :beer:

#3 River


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Posted 07 April 2003 - 04:36 PM

I emailed Keran re her interest in Armenian , especially, Cilician history. She is a bright lady who wants to do more research into Medieval Armenian History focusing on the interaction between Europeans (Crusaders) and Armenians. That falls right into my line of interest.
What we need is as much info as possible. She has access to books but any input would be much appreciated.
As 'hytga' says " KNOWLEDGE IS POWER".
Thanks in advance.

#4 gamavor


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Posted 07 April 2003 - 08:58 PM

By far the Vatican has the most comprehensive collection of books and resources regarding Crusaders and Armenians. There are also some very useful books about Armenians written by noble knights - travelers and geographers. Some of the ones that I read reveal some very interesting details about Armenians, especially during war times. It turns out that we have not been always the "good" guys. :)

#5 River


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Posted 08 April 2003 - 03:02 PM

Hi Gamavor, thanks for the info. I'll try to do a search of the Vatican archives- although i have not 'visited' their site.
As for the Crusades, i think, they reflected how brutal human beings can be. I would go as far as labelling it one of the ugliest ventures undertaken under the pretext of Christianity or religion ( any similarities with what's happening in Iraq - partially ?) Check out beliefnet.com for the last commentary. Another form of 'globalisation'. I believe that a good number of the Crusaders were there for their personal gains. Of course there were convicts who were given a chance to 'be free' if they participated in the armed forces. Why not ? Either way they were not in charge of their destiny.
Anything that has to do with overstepping the rights of another person does not contain 'noble' intentions.
Just to digress a bit here's what i read on another forum : it's attributed to Ben Franklin-
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what is for lunch.
Liberty is when a well-armed lamb disputes the decision.
Cheers !

#6 gamavor


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Posted 08 April 2003 - 09:33 PM

I agree. It seems to me that not being able to learn from our own mistakes is part of our human nature.
Friend of main says. "When we were born, we were hungry, naked, wet and crying... after some time the situation got worst than that!"

Cheers to you too:)

#7 axel



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Posted 10 April 2003 - 04:42 AM

The following document should be of great interest to you (especially if you know the french language). it includes, among other things, historical texts in armenian with their corresponding translation in french. the only drawback is that you need a good connection for the download ("téléchargement de l'ouvrage") as each page has been rasterized before being put in pdf format. I suggest you browse it first online before attempting any download :).


#8 Arpa



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Posted 10 April 2003 - 05:37 AM

Here are a few sites about the Crusades and Armenia.
The book at the bottom seems interesting. Wonder if it is still available?




#9 axel



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Posted 10 April 2003 - 05:42 AM

actually the book I posted (which was printed in 1869!) includes extracts of the chronicle of Mathew of Edessa (both the original armenian text and the french translation)

#10 River


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Posted 10 April 2003 - 08:07 AM

Thanks a million
To think that i spent one full hour on google researching the crusades. This is great help. I shall refer Keran (her text appears on this thread) to your posts. I do read french, no problem- i live in Quebec, Canada.

#11 Arpa



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Posted 10 April 2003 - 11:38 AM

Now that we gloated with the virtues of the Armenians, and their hospitality and alliance with the Crusaders, let's see what happened once they rand away with their tails between their legs.

The principality of Cilicia became, the Kingdom of Cilician Armenia or Lesser Armenia as it was know to the European historians. The kingdom lasted for nearly 200 years. The Kingdom of Cilician Armenia, the last outpost of Christianity and Christian faith, fell to the Moslem Invaders, the Mameluks who having destroyed the Christian Crusader states of
Jerusalem and Antioch had turn their attention to the remaining obstacle in their reconquest of Near East.
The last Armenian king of
the House of Lusignan, which had frankish descent and blood lines with the Royal House of Rubinian, king Levon VI th was captured
in the year 1375 A.D. by the Mameluks in the siege of Sis, the great capital of Cilicia, he was taken prisoner and later on released
for the runsack of his head, paid by the Franks. He spent the remainder of His life in Courts of France, Spain and other European
Royal Courts, trying to convince the European powers of a launch of a new Crusade for the liberation of Cilicia and Holy Land, from
the Moslem rule, which he was not able to accomplish.

The above is not unique, our history is replete with betrayals by our so called allies, co-religionists and our so called European brothers. In fact this same scenario is being played at this very moment. Turkey may have suffered a slight setback yet, as we read these lines Turkey has already sent "observers" to Northern Iraq ostensibly to protect their "brothers" the Turkomans and their "executioners" the Kurds. Wait till Turkey gets a hold of those oil wells. You think gas prices are hign now??

BTW. Where is Bass/Bassam?
He stormed in here preaching antiIslam and proCatholic sermons and disappeared. I just surveyed a URL by the Assyrians/Chaldeans. See below and tell us where do they even mention the Armenian saga or show even the slightest sympathy and similarity in destiny? If the likes of him and his Pope had stuck with us rather than kissing Mordechai Cohen's v**** and seeking his approval to simply exist!!!???
Assyria. Please click and follow leads to better understand.

#12 Arpa



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Posted 10 April 2003 - 12:32 PM

Let us reread below section from the above quote and consider some alternatives.
What would the outcome have been had we not welcomed the Crusaders and isntead allied ourselves with our neighbors? Had we negotiated with the Mamluks ans others, signed nonagression compacts and had military alliance and mutual defense agreements with them?
Look what King Levon had to do, kissing the feet of those so called cynical Crusaders to no avail.
They came, they enjoyed our hospitality, military and logistical assistance and at the end they abandoned us leaving the cross behind for us to bear the full brunt, and the vengeance of our neighbors.
I could tell them what to do with their "cross" but I won't.
There are ladies here.
"The last Armenian king of the House of Lusignan, which had frankish descent and blood lines with the Royal House of Rubinian, king Levon VI th was captured in the year 1375 A.D. by the Mameluks in the siege of Sis, the great capital of Cilicia, he was taken prisoner and later on released for the runsack of his head, paid by the Franks. He spent the remainder of His life in Courts of France, Spain and other European Royal Courts, trying to convince the European powers of a launch of a new Crusade for the liberation of Cilicia and Holy Land, from the Moslem rule, which he was not able to accomplish." :angry:

#13 gamavor


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Posted 10 April 2003 - 12:46 PM


I agree with you. We too often listen to our hearts rather than to the reason.
Bulgarians for example fought with Crusaders, although they were Christian at that time. They simply said no one can pass through our lands without testing the sharpness of our swords. They caused great damage to Crusaderes who later have choosen different roads to reach Jerusalem. After that the Latins were subjected to humiliating conditions under Bulgarian King. That way you gain respect.

#14 River


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Posted 10 April 2003 - 12:53 PM

Hi Arpa, the Turks are allowed to send 'observers' to Kirkuk. Yeah, right with all the military concentration at the border (bbc.co.uk sources) corresponds to ....as the saying goes......"aghvesseh havnotsin bahaban en garkel", aka the fox is in charge of the .....what does he like most? ...chicken. The Kurdish rejoice would be short-lived. What a catastrophy; how many fronts are opened up now ? Nobody would give up oil-rather- the economics of it. Have you read THE LAST JIHAD by Joel C.Rosenberg ? He quotes Jeremiah 51:24, 37 talking about .....and 'awe'.
Politics is nasty- never nice. You have to play dirty to stay in the game, unfortunately. I think we would be very naive to ever think there would be someone who out of the goodness of their heart will pat our back and say...Armenians are good people, hard-working, industrious, christian etc. ...they deserve to have a homeland, not lose their shirt, kingdom. If what Armenians want does not fall into their plans - like , perhaps, the last Cilician King's plans , then forget it. Remember Kherimian Hayrig with his 'Iron Ladle' analogy ?
As, for the Crusaders, i do not recall any good works done. Killing, in the name of religion, is never justified. Freeing Jerusalem from heathens resulted in the killing of numerous human beings. How disturbing and horrendous. Rather disgusting. The so called 'white european' proved to be no different from the Moors or the Seljuk Turks (?) with the brutality he performed. Have you read Dr. Runciman's account of the Crusades. He portrays the Armenians as one of the most conniving ethnic groups- basing himself on the accounts of the Byzantines. We could say the same about the Byzantines, too. Our relationship with them lacked trust. They are always at loggerheads stealing principalities, lands, crowns from each other. As Karl Marx implied economics is the fundamental reason for war between nations - even simple citizens.
Phew, i've been jumping from one topic to another !
Keep well.

#15 gamavor


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Posted 23 April 2005 - 10:16 PM

The Tomb of King Levon at the Basilica of Saint Denis.

Jean-Claude Kebabdjian

Paris — An Armenian-style church at Germigny-des-PrËs south of Pithiviers on the River Loire, lost like a lonely jewel in the depths of France, is one of the examples of early contacts between the French and Armenian people dating back to between the 10th and 12th centuries.

Religious contacts were established during this period and these are documented in the country’s oldest historical records. The French were in no doubt, even way back, that Armenians would play an important role in the future.

The Crusaders were a glorious turning point. Political and commercial links flourished between the French and Armenians. First of all there were blood ties, stretching right up to almost the royal palaces. The last Regent of the Armenian Kingdom of Cilicia , Leon VI of Lusignan, of French stock, died in 1393 in Paris and was buried at the Saint Denis Basilica just to the north of the French capital.

After that, Cardinal Richelieu and Colbert helped the Armenians set up trading posts.


#16 CCA



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Posted 11 January 2006 - 08:47 PM

Hmmmm ....

This article is just a collection of some common knoweledge on Cilician Armenia. Bedoukian, in his coinage of Cilician Armenia spends a great deal on the history. The history of Cilician Armenia comes from mostly original historic text and some works of Mekhitarists and Victor Langlois. For a good amount of bibliograbhy of Cilician Armenia see the sources Bedoukian provides.

Also missed an important historian Smbat, of the 13th century, commander in chief of Armenian forces when a Mamluk invasion was defeated.

Non-Armenian sources can sometimes be useful as well.


#17 gamavor


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Posted 24 March 2009 - 05:52 AM

The tomb of Levon V Lusignan on youtube! Saint Denis is a great place to visit, btw!

#18 gamavor


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Posted 08 May 2009 - 07:49 AM

Just came back from a trip to San Lazzaro Armeni in Venice. A must visit place for every Armenian. This is allegedly the sword of Levon the VI donated by Alishan.

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...and the memorial plaque for the great poet Lord Byron!

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#19 MosJan


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Posted 08 May 2009 - 10:33 AM

hetaqrqir ashxatanq e

#20 gamavor


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Posted 08 May 2009 - 11:34 AM

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Ayo Mosjan, scancheli portsarutiun er!

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